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Apr 21 13 2:50 AM

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Hello all this is my first post

Why "Nam" isnt popular in 28mm?
Because the metal figs are very expensive, Who is going to spend 7€ in 4 vietcong figs having 30 WWII figs per 20€.
I tihnk can be great make two boxes of 25-30 figs of the bloodiest war afte the WWII per only 20€:


-Viet Cong Box:
It can have 3 sprues of vietcong torsos with multipose arms, heads, and equipment like ammo pouches, backpacks, canteens and hats(coolie hat, bush hat and maybe pith helmets) amd 1 weapon sprue with weapons like AK47s, RPKs, RPGs, DP28, PPSH41, Mat49, SKSs....

 -US Infantry (options to make AirCav, Marines and Green Berets):
It can have 3 sprues of torsos with multipose arms and some equipment, and 1 sprue of weapons
like M16s, M14s, M60s, M79 blooper, M97 shotguns...



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#1 [url]

Apr 21 13 3:37 AM

Yes, but then you have to have rules about the idiotic rules of warfare they had to endure for the Americans and the even worse objectives that made absolutely no military sense whatsoever from the politicians.

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#2 [url]

Apr 21 13 4:12 AM

melkor,

Welcome to our forums! Vietnam is an interesting idea. Thank you for the suggestion. 

What periods besides Vietnam are you interested in gaming?

towerwarlock,

PERFECT! That is the issue with this particular war. It would be very challenging to make a game system that could reflect your points AND still be fun for the players to play. Thank you!

Jim

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#3 [url]

Apr 21 13 5:01 AM

Well...
Early Imperial Rome-28mm
Vikings-28mm
Mongols-28mm
WWI-28mm and 10mm
Pulp 1930s-28mm
WWII-28mm,15mm and 6mm
Vietnam War-28mm and 15mm
And maybe i buy some zombies and survivors
Oops and the Lord of the Rings!

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macasm

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#4 [url]

Apr 21 13 6:24 AM

Flames of War does the Vietnam war in 15mm. But you are correct, trying to get a set of rules that act disjointed and completely out of sorts with any military rules of war would be hard.

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potter

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#5 [url]

Apr 21 13 6:44 AM


There are some really great 28mm Vietnam figs out there such as those by TAG, and now as mentioned by Macasm FoW do the conflict in a smaller scale.

There's also some generic rule systems that incorporate weapons and forces from this war though I've never used them some can't comment.

I did see a few shots of a great demo game a few years ago (in Wargames Illustrated) where the boards were set up for tunnel fighting and the next section would not be revealed until the previous one cleared.

I'm not sure how 'popular' it is world wide, though I could certainly see it becoming more so were more rank and file available in plastic.

It does lead to another question however, there are fewer again figures available for the Korean War.

Certainly you can use some WWII era troops for US, South Korean and UK and Commonwealth forces etc, however there are no figures that I am aware of for North Korean and Chinese forces in 28mm. Though you could use some converted 28mm PPSH armed troops are proxies. They are however available in 1/72 from Imex, and very nice I'm sure they are.

Is there anything you can't combine with the Persian figs?

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potter

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#6 [url]

Apr 21 13 6:45 AM


RE: The above use of the word popular-I am not condoning any war or conflict, I mean it in a gaming perspective only no offense to anyone intended.

I'm not being all politically correct or 'wow are'nt I caring', but I find it odd that when people sometimes speak of modern conflicts being in poor taste for gaming 'Somalia, Iraq, Afghanistan etc, they seem to forget that to many WWII, Vietnam, Suez, Burma, Oman The Falklands, Serbia and a never ending stream of 'Hot Zone' conflicts involving far too many young men and women and civilians being killed are all withing living memory.

Ok I'm going to shut up now I'm getting on a depressive rant....

Nothing to see here move along....Sorry everybody

Is there anything you can't combine with the Persian figs?

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jack

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#7 [url]

Apr 21 13 7:35 AM

Ive never played FOW, the original WW II or the newer Vietnam version, but I love the scale for the armor. And the fact some, perhaps in time all armor and AFV's will be done in plastic, is great.

Speaking briefly about armor and scale, while FOW brings back some fond memories of 1/72 model battles in my past, for sheer 'size' in armor, I think the Axis & Allies minitures are practically perfect. Im not sure what scale they are actually modeled on.
Of course I realize in reality, theres no such thing as an "armor only battle" you always have various AFVs as well as infantry support.
But what can I say, "Me likes to push tanks and make other tanks go.. BOOM!"  

And last thought on the FOW, If I had ever or do ever get into the game, Ive already decided I think I'd have to go with an Indian unit of the Commonwealth.  First I think their cool because they are different.. and I have rarely seen anyone here use them.
And I'd love to see a game or two of the 'Nam version also.

"You see old friend, I brought more soldiers than you did." 'King Leonidas - 300'

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#9 [url]

Apr 23 13 12:08 PM

To make the US troops for Vietnam you can combine the guys from the WWII box for the US with arms from the Apocalypse survivors that have the M-16. Just need a radio operator or two.

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#10 [url]

Apr 24 13 5:32 AM

towerwarlock,

That is a great idea, thank you!

Has anyone tried to make interchangeable arms for 28 MM figures? I know my resin friends like to drill holes and use dowels to connect hard to glue resin sections. 

My thought is do the same to the WW-II American arms. Use a drill and dowel, not glued arm from each set. As towerwarlock notes above since the only change is with the weapon arm you now have a WW-II AND Vietnam soldier AND Apocalypse survivor. I am talking a 'pin' sized hole, and then the dowel could be a stick pin without a 'head'.

I love the idea of three armies being fielded from 2 boxes of miniatures!

What does everyone think?

Jim

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potter

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#12 [url]

Apr 24 13 12:49 PM


I wonder if head from the Ashigaru figs could be used for heads for the Viet-Cong with Persian bodies?

They both have the flat flush neck joint. With the AK's from the Survivors, and some possible weapons from the forth coming Soviets it could be possible.

Admittedly, the bodies would not be perfect, but they would be loose fitting and 'basic'. Sorry if I'm stereotyping the 'Black Pyjama' look. There may not be any Cu Chi vests (I believe that is what they have been nicknamed), but I'm sure they could be done with greens stuff etc, and the dagger on the Persians could easily be scraped or filed off.

Is there anything you can't combine with the Persian figs?

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mrinku

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#13 [url]

Apr 24 13 1:05 PM

My experience in general for fitting heads to bodies is that anything can be made to match anything. Even when you have a "socket" connector for both head and neck, a small bead can be used to make a join, finished off with putty.

Sounds like a very solid idea.

Mark Dewis

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#14 [url]

Apr 25 13 6:45 AM

Hello all this is my first post
Why "Nam" isnt popular in 28mm?
Because the metal figs are very expensive, Who is going to spend 7€ in 4 vietcong figs having 30 WWII figs per 20€.
I tihnk can be great make two boxes of 25-30 figs of the bloodiest war afte the WWII per only 20€:

-Viet Cong Box:
It can have 3 sprues of vietcong torsos with multipose arms, heads, and equipment like ammo pouches, backpacks, canteens and hats(coolie hat, bush hat and maybe pith helmets) amd 1 weapon sprue with weapons like AK47s, RPKs, RPGs, DP28, PPSH41, Mat49, SKSs....
 -US Infantry (options to make AirCav, Marines and Green Berets):
It can have 3 sprues of torsos with multipose arms and some equipment, and 1 sprue of weapons
like M16s, M14s, M60s, M79 blooper, M97 shotguns...


-melkor


Hello,

I have played a bit of modern warfare.  For Nam I use the Two hour rargame rules for skirmishes.  I also have charlie company rules from RAFM.  I also use their figures.  Britannia miniatures also make 20mm models.

There is no problem with the 28mm.  Personally I will use them for skirmishes,  But I do not really like them.  Back in the 70´s and 80´s I made the choice to use smaller figures 15mm and 1/300 figures for mass combats.  Then the 15mm started to be use for the bigger skirmisher.  To me it depends how the figures look on the table.  You have game mostly played either on a table between 4´ by 4´ to 6´ by 5´ sometimes you may get a larger playing area.  Units take up a lot of room as do buildings and other terrain features.  The whole thing to me seems to crowed and unrealistic.  So using the same amount of figures and terrain pieces in a smaller scale gives more table top breathing room.

One of the best games I have played in was a tank battle using 1/300 scale models on a 6´by 5´ table.  a 1/300 model at 12" is not the same as a 28mm at the same distance.

By the way a lot of people will spend the money on the models.  This is not a poor man´s hobby. You will find out soon enough.  You will probably want to expand get a few vehicules then you will get something for the other side. You are just lucky that manufactures are developping a much better plactic model today. 

One bit of advice always build both sides of a conflict.  Never just one side.

Best regards,

Jean

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#15 [url]

Apr 25 13 9:13 AM

I think the problem is that Vietnam does not make much sense as a wargame.

There was one Nam board game where the Vietnamese player could choose not to have any troops at all. If the American player had not worked that out by a certain number of turns, then the Vietnamese won.

Sort of like colonial warfare, the natives have little chance of military victory but you hope that some day, some how they will win.

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macasm

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#16 [url]

Apr 25 13 12:24 PM

Yeah, you got it Justin.
Not many find fun in having so much stacked against them at the start. Might as well play Bretonnians or Imperial Guard.

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mrinku

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#17 [url]

Apr 25 13 2:39 PM


I think the problem is that Vietnam does not make much sense as a wargame.There was one Nam board game where the Vietnamese player could choose not to have any troops at all. If the American player had not worked that out by a certain number of turns, then the Vietnamese won.Sort of like colonial warfare, the natives have little chance of military victory but you hope that some day, some how they will win.

-zedeyejoe

I think you're confusing "simulation" with "game". In most real life combat situations each side doesn't line up with equal points and predefined starting areas, yet that is the norm for most wargames.

However, at the company or smaller level that most 28mm minis would be used for, it's quite reasonable to game out normal stand-up firefights for Vietnam. These happened. There's no imperative to simulate broader "typical" patrol situations.

And it's unfair to compare 19th C colonial wars with the Vietnam war. The VC were well equipped with modern weapons and each side had some advantages over the other in different areas.

Heck, even if you limit your games to taking place during the Tet Offensive, you can just do shooty patrol games. 

Mark Dewis

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jack

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#18 [url]

Apr 25 13 9:56 PM

    In most real life combat situations each side doesn't line up with equal points and predefined starting areas, yet that is the norm for most wargames.

-mrinku

  Mrinku,
You do make a very good and simple point. After all, thats why we play and use things such as "point systems", to give both sides a fair chance.

"You see old friend, I brought more soldiers than you did." 'King Leonidas - 300'

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#19 [url]

Apr 26 13 5:24 AM

"And it's unfair to compare 19th C colonial wars with the Vietnam war. The VC were well equipped with modern weapons and each side had some advantages over the other in different areas."

But of course without the tanks, artillery and air support that the US forces could count on.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Stingray-Marines-Behind-Vietnam-ebook/dp/B007XPLKA4

Yep I stick to my view, vastly inferior forces facing the USA, as a wargame fairly pointless.

You could of course limit the action to US soldiers with personal weapons only (and make it a fair fight) but that does seem unrealistic.

Korean war better balanced game IMHO.

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bryon31

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#20 [url]

Apr 26 13 6:47 AM

Just finished reading Americas Longest War by George Herring and Sacred War by William Duiker. Both are great reads and in depth about the Vietnam War, I highly recommend them if you're interested in the Vietnam War.

That being said I have to agree with the points Justin makes about Vietnam being a good war for gaming purposes. Soldier to soldier it’s likely that the North Vietnamese were better fighters, they had more experience. U.S. troops were serving 1 year tours and were constantly being replaced. It was like a conveyer belt system of troops. After a year of service the veteran soldiers would go home leaving their job to a green kid. However, U.S. air superiority was more than enough to tip the balance in the U.S.'s favor. Remember that the U.S. dropped 3 times more bombs on Vietnam than they did in the entire Second World War.

The battle I'd find most interesting from a gaming stand point would be Dien Ben Phu which was actually between the French and Vietnamese. But I digress who would want to play a French army? I guess the siege of the U.S. embassy during the Tet offensive could be a fun skirmish game. Or the battle for Hue.

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